Loxley II Write-up

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As promised, now my hangover is wearing off, I’m getting round to writing up last night’s meet-up. I can’t promise to remember everything, because I’d had a few pints, but I’ll do my best.

We had a brief discussion on ideology and although we don’t all agree 100% on every detail, I think we do all wish to move in the same general direction.

We discussed our relationship to existing political parties like the Labour party and the Socialist Workers’ Party.  We decided that it would be counterproductive to compete against existing parties and that we should endevour to work with them.  I leave it to individuals how they do so, it’d be good if those who are party members could keep us updated of trends within the parties.

We decided we wanted to create some kind of Wiki/Blog/thing to summarise and collate information on the economy, from a heterodox perspective.  The site I was referring to was Skeptical Science which allows you to switch between different levels of detail.  Maybe we could do something similar debunking the myths of mainstream economics?

It would be good to expand online means of communication, too.  We already use #Loxley on twitter; how about a forum or IRC channel for the tech-savvy?

We considered the idea of putting ourselves forward to the press as a think tank, using the same tactics that small, right wing organisations have used to punch above their weight.  If we present ourselves as expects confidently, we stand a chance of being treated so.  Perhaps we could put out releases when the government makes economic descisions?

We decided that we want to keep our activist and community actions separate, doing something non-political to demonstrate our ideas.  We discussed time banking – does anybody know if there is an existing time bank locally?  We also brought up the idea of creating some kind of agency, recruitment or otherwise, that acted in an impartial manner and was itself run as a worker cooperative.  We decided that any operation to exist within the existing economy, as a by-economy, would do well if it could provide the basic means of subsistence.  Ivor suggested looking into the laws relating to allotments and community land – perhaps some kind of community farm where people are paid in an hour-based currency, which they can then trade back for a share of the produce?  Any ideas to cheaply gain use of a small land area?

We said that if we weren’t 100% concrete on model, the best thing would be to try something on a small scale – effectively modelling a new economy, but building iteratively to minimise risk.  I said I believed that if we were successful, there would be no need for a revolution in the traditional sense, because the current system would simply be obseleted by people moving to a better way within it.

We decided that the activist branch should continue its #Loxley discussions.  I believe we set a date of the 14th November for our next meeting.  It was proposed that every person should endevour to bring one other person, thereby raising numbers again.  The single formal motion to be passed was to elect the Adelphi in Leeds as the recurring venue, which was unanimously approved.

It was suggested that in addition to these meets, the activist arm should consider its relationship with existing protests &c.  Perhaps we could fill in the gap for those who are angry at the current system but aren’t sure what they want?  Maybe we could create simple fliers describing our main ideas to distribute at protests?  I think we should use our position as a thinking body to give direction to others.

All in all there’s still a lot that isn’t concrete, but I’d rather have some good ideas buzzing around than one poor idea nailed down.  I think it would be good to make some practical inroads however – does anyone want to put themselves forward to progressing a certain issue?  I know Alan was enthusiastic about the wiki and Ivor brought up the idea of veg growing an allotment land.  Dave, I know you’re already involved in the Labour party, so keep us informed of things there.

If I’ve missed anything, someone please add in the comments.  I hope to see you all again on the 14th Nov at the Adelphi.  Let’s try and keep in touch in between and at least look into the prospects of some practical ideas.  I very much want this to be a distributed thing, so talk to each other and progress ideas in smaller groups.  If you’re happy to have me for now, I’ll keep acting in a secretarial manner, organising and writing up meetings.

Oh – and if you don’t have one, buy a black hat! ;)

  • Alan L

    I should probably state my perspective at this fairly early stage – I don’t like political parties much because I don’t think they work very well most of the time; I don’t like political demonstrations (especially) because I find them to be futile and impotent – I’ve been on a few marches and never witnessed institutions of power pay any attention to them; I don’t like leafletting, pamphletting or any other top-down distribution of information, because, once again, I don’t think these forms of information distribution work very well to inform those who might act or think differently if they had such information. I find a lot of this sort of stuff is antiquated, inefficient, ineffective, non-representative and non-democratic.nnWith regard to building bottom-up social alternatives, I am interested in what works, what captures the public interest, where the public interest and enthusiasm then drives the whole momentum forward.nnLove them or hate them, each the followingu00a0 have proven to be highly effective (whether they are desirable or not): gossip via social media (e.g. the Ryan Giggs injunction fiasco); ultra-convenient P2P communication (mobile phones, social networking); appeals to mass-imagined identities (geographic, ethnic, religious etc.); appeals to winning material-gain-for-nothing (Deal or No Deal); creating and maintaing celebrity… and there are, I imagine, many more categories of things that have mass motivational appeal too…

  • Anonymous

    I wish I could have some more involvement in this, but living so far away makes it hard for obvious reasons.u00a0 I would like to be kept up to date with everything you are doing though and if there is any input I can have I would love to get involved somehow.u00a0 nnI think there are some really interesting ideas flowing here and I have to agree with Alan, I don’t like leafleting either.u00a0 I think that most people throw them straight in the bin as they get their backs up.u00a0 I think in the modern world it is better to diseminate information in some technological form.u00a0 Let people discover information and spread it on social sites and blogging.nnKeep up the good work and keep me in the loop.

  • Alan L

    “Let people discover information and spread it on social sites and blogging.”nnYes! Couldn’t agree more. I think you’ve squarely hit the nail on the head. Let people discover information [on blogs, on websites, on Facebook pages etc.] and spread it themselves; let people discover new activities [via Eventbrite, MeetUp, etc.] and go along themselves and then tell their friends; let people discover groups [on Facebook, on LinkedIn etc.] and participate and then tell their peers and industry colleagues…nnUltimately, people tend to receive warmly and welcome information and recommendations which come from people they know, like and trust and tend to close their ears to unsolicited messages from people they don’t know and have never heard of.nnThat’s why I think bottom-up is a much better approach (and dramatically more democratic) than top-down.

  • http://www.tymchak.com Ivor

    Have to agree with Alan. The old ideas need replacing. C’mon guys, we’re supposed to be smart, let’s invent some new ideas even if it’s something as simple as ‘Art as revolution’. We need practical activities, community, fun…people will only adopt another system if it is a better one. nnLet’s also use the skills available to us; if we have a marketer on board, let them think up a captivating strapline for the group; if we have a photographer, let them take pictures that ‘hype’ the meetings… We need people to WANT to be part of the movement.

  • http://www.danladds.com Dan Ladds

    Okay, here’s how I understand it now:nnWhat we don’t want to do:nu00a0– Traditional activism,u00a0leafletting, protestingnu00a0– Take part in the regular political systemnu00a0– Talk all day and put out flat, bland press releasesnnWhat we do want to do:nu00a0– Offer information for people to discover and spread themselves using social media and word of mouth.nu00a0 u00a0 – Using tools like Facebook, Twitter, WordPress, Wiki, Eventbrite &cnu00a0 u00a0 – No long reports; bite-sized bits of info that can be easily propogatednu00a0 u00a0 – Still cater for different audiences and levels of understandingnu00a0 u00a0 – Perhaps appeal to sense of belonging – spread movement by people encouraging their friends to “be part of it”nu00a0– Kick off some kind of practical effort to do something good and also demonstrate a non-capitalist way of people working together successfully, without any overt political agenda.nu00a0 u00a0 – Involve creativity and the artsnu00a0 u00a0 – Try and meet basic needs for people right nownu00a0 u00a0 – Take an iterative approach to finding what worksnnDoes that roughly correlate with what you guys are thinking?

  • Ivor

    That’s how I see it.

  • http://www.danladds.com Dan Ladds

    Well, that works for me.